S10E3 - Mike Nellis
In this episode of 'More Than Work,' host Rabiah Coon sits down with Mike Nellis, a Democratic strategist and creator of the Substack newsletter "Endless Urgency." Mike shares his compelling personal journey from struggling with depression and weight management to becoming a prominent voice in Democratic politics and digital strategy. He opens up about his philosophy of "endless urgency" - living every moment fully and intentionally - which emerged from his own experiences with suicidal ideation and a transformational journey from 600 pounds to a healthier, more engaged life.
The conversation covers Mike's 20-year career in political strategy, his work on major campaigns including Bernie Sanders' 2016 run, and his role as a co-founder of "White Dudes for Harris." He discusses the current state of the Democratic Party, the importance of engaging with voters across the political spectrum, and why Democrats need to be more strategic about communicating with all Americans - including those who disagree with them. Mike also reflects on the challenges of the 2024 election, the need for Democrats to understand and wield power more effectively, and the critical importance of showing up in uncomfortable spaces to have difficult conversations.
Throughout the episode, Mike emphasizes the value of building systems, staying present, and finding joy even during challenging political times. He shares mantras and advice for maintaining momentum, from "1% better every day" to being a "joyful warrior" in the face of adversity.
Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
00:35 Welcome and guest introduction
01:31 What is "Endless Urgency"?
01:47 Mike's journey: from 600 pounds to transformation
09:19 What the Substack offers: No BS Democratic strategy
14:29 How Mike got into political strategy
19:51 Staying in the Democratic Party vs. going independent
20:31 Kamala Harris and the 2024 election: what went wrong
24:37 Strategic messaging and power
31:51 Handling family members who voted for Trump
35:48 Why cutting people out weakens democracy
38:41 Going on Fox News and right-wing media
43:16 "White Dudes for Harris" and organizing men
44:31 Mantras and advice: 1% better every day
47:16 Being a "joyful warrior"
52:19 Who inspires Mike right now
Note from Rabiah (host):
Mike Nellis is who I would have liked to be when it comes to career.
Host Rabiah (London) chats with Endless Urgency creator and Democratic Strategist Mike Nellis (Chicago).
Transcript
Rabiah Coon (host): [00:00:00] This is More Than Work, the podcast reminding you that your self worth is made up of more than your job title. Each week I'll talk to a guest about how they discovered that for themselves. You'll hear about what they did, what they're doing, and who they are. I'm your host, Rabiah. I work in IT, perform standup comedy, write, volunteer, and of course, podcast.
Thank you for listening. Here we go. Welcome back to More Than Work everyone. My guest today is Mike Nellis. He's a Democratic strategist and he's the host of Endless Urgency, which you can find on Substack. So I'm really excited to have Mike here today and welcome to More Than Work, Mike. Where am I talking to you.
Mike Nellis: you. I'm, I'm in the city of Chicago where it's currently negative 10 degrees outside.
Rabiah Coon (host): Crazy. That's so bad. Yeah. Usually I'm talking to my friends and family in California, so I can [00:01:00] complain about London weather, but I am not going to do that to you. 'cause it is basically like being on the beach right now here compared to that.
to
Mike Nellis: about living in Chicago is 75% of the time it's the greatest city in America by far. Like not even close in my opinion. and then 25% of the time it's Hoth from Star Wars, which is just awful.
Rabiah Coon (host): That is awful. But, I'm, I'm glad you're, you know, at least staying thawed enough to do this, this podcast. So, I think just first of all, let's just talk about what is Endless
Mike Nellis: So a, a Endless Urgency is my Substack. The, the phrase comes from is like my personal life phrase. And for just a little bit of background for people like I, if you can't see me, 'cause this is a podcast, I'm a pretty big guy. I weigh like about 320 some odd pounds, but I used to weigh 600 pounds.
And over the course of, uh you know, being a, a political operative and a bunch of like personal and professional traas, I did a really crappy job of taking care of myself. And in my twenties I drank a lot, and I dissociated a lot with video games and I [00:02:00] kind of realized that was unhealthy. And then over the course of like a 10 year period, actually more, probably more 20 year period, to be honest with you, I ate and I ate, and I ate for every emotion, happiness, sad, anxiety, depression, didn't matter. And I've struggled with, uh, suicidal ideation basically my entire life. And, uh, so I basically tried to kill myself with food and got to 600 pounds, , sometime in the middle of the first Trp term. So I apologize to anybody not political.
I'm a political guy by nature, so everything that I say is gonna be relative to who was president at the time. But uh, so I ballooned up to 600 pounds and then, you know, it's a longer story, which we can get into if you want, but like had kind of a bottoming out period where like I, you know, I, I basically nearly killed myself in the middle of the COVID pandemic, and at the height of like the George Floyd protest and stuff like that, and started to work and claw my way out of it.
And what I realized was like, one of the things was I wasn't living my life to its fullest. And what I decided was, as I started to do the mental and physical work that needed to be done to be the person I am today, I needed to develop something new and that became what I call Endless Urgency, which is my, [00:03:00] uh, I have a couple of like phrases that define my life, and one of them is I have "endless urgency" in everything that I do.
And sometimes that phrase triggers people where they think it's like, I gotta have endless urgency at work. Or, everything's gotta be endlessly urgent in politics 'cause it feels like there's a crisis a minute. But for me it's whatever I'm doing, I'm present in it, I'm doing it a hundred percent. I am an extremely intense individual.
You can ask anybody in my life. Most of them love being around me, but I also drive them insane 'cause I get hyper fixated on things. But then when I went to name my Substack, I was like okay, well this is the phrase that I use. How do I define it in politics? And so for me, endless urgency relative to my career, is sort of a, a in homage to
one, the respect I have for the Trp administration, and that's gonna sound like an odd thing coming from a Democratic strategist, but I, I respect how they are endlessly urgent to steal and thieve and hurt people and use the power of the federal government in ways that drive me absolutely up the wall.
And I would like the future version of the Democratic Party that takes over [00:04:00] to be endlessly urgent in the same way to use power in the same way, but not to hurt people or to steal, but to make sure people don't go bankrupt when they get sick and to make sure that, uh, kids aren't starting their lives, getting outta college with a mountain of student loan debt.
Like, I'd like to see that version of the Democratic Party. So that's what it's there. It's me staking my claim to what I think the future can be, and it's sort of ideologically, agnostic. Like I'm not a, I'm not a leftist. I would, I'm not a corporate dem. I like, I'm kind of in the middle. I work for people that I think genuinely care.
, and, and so for me it's about building like the Democratic party's understanding of power, and we use the Substack to kind of get through what's going on on any given day. So, like at the time that we're recording this, basically everything we're talking about right now is about the murder of Alex Preddy in, in Minneapolis by A-A-C-B-B agent this weekend.
, and, uh, that's, that's what we use it for. And we've got a, a community of almost 1.2 million people, uh which is really cool and we're in the, we're in the top 100, uh, bestsellers on Substack, so I'm really proud of like what we've been able to build together in such a short period of time.
Rabiah Coon (host): I mean, it's a, it's an incredible following and you know, for someone like me [00:05:00] who's doing their own like media and own content creation and nowhere near those nbers, it's super impressive. But it's also just shows your dedication as well and your like, how people regard you as a place to go for information.
And so there was a lot there that I could talk about. I think endless urgency, the way you said it makes a lot of sense and resonates with me as someone living with MS. Like I've had to live my life in that way, which is hard for people to understand 'cause they're like, just take a break. Why are you so busy all the time?
But it's hard to take a break when, when you do feel like there's like this other thing that maybe could happen, know? And even the other things you talked about with the depression and, amazing, I mean, congratulations on just figuring out how to manage your weight in a different way 'cause that's so stressful and difficult and even now in the age of Ozempic, like, and the pressure to, you know, do that when you don't want to is really tough. So, [00:06:00] yeah, just first of all, congrats on
Mike Nellis: you., and thanks for, thanks for sharing, your, your MS diagnosis. Like, I can't imagine, you know, I, I, I, I don't know anyone personally except for you now that, has MS, but I, I, based on what I know about, it's like good days and bad days. And I have to imagine, I have to imagine you live your life sort of similar to me is like, I. I feel like I should be dead already. Like, I feel like every day that I'm living is already borrowed time, and maybe I have another 50 years, but I, I don't know. but like, and I, and I'm kind of somebody like, I, I should be dead like five times over, like, not the, what I've described to you, but like, I was born with the bilical cord severely wrapped around my neck.
I was all black and blue and barely breathing. Were you too, yeah.
Rabiah Coon (host): I was, I was breach. And I joke about like, why was anyone surprised when I was depressed when I announced it at the start? You know? Which is kind of a dark That's pretty good. I I'm gonna put a trigger warning on this episode.
Mike Nellis: that's pretty good. But like, I also, like I once got hit by a semi. I once had like a rare disease where I almost lost my leg when I was in my early twenties. It's just like, there's just been enough brushes with it where I'm [00:07:00] like, man, I mean something somewhere's keeping me alive and like I'm a, I'm a practicing Catholic, and, and I, I believe that, that God has some kind of purpose for me somewhere. I don't know what it is. so, and I'm not like a hyper religious, like, you know, God's made me like a blah blah, but I'm just like, there's a reason I'm here and I might as well figure it out. And, and in the meantime it's like I have, I wanna go, I wanna see every movie that I can, I wanna read every book that I can.
I wanna like spend my time intentionally and not, If you go back to when I was like depressed and I was dissociating, it was like playing the same stupid video game over and over again because it was comforting. Watching the same stupid TV show. Like, I've watched The Office 10 billion times. I've watched Parks and Rec 10 billion times, which is fine. Right now, I could quote any episode of The Office or, or, or Parks and Rec or Community or something like that, which is great. But like I, there's other content out there, so like if I'm watching something, I put my phone down, it's in the other room. Like, I try to be like thoughtful and intentional about it.
Rabiah Coon (host): Yeah, no, that makes sense. And, that, yeah, that is amazing. And I, it's funny because I didn't expect us to have these things in common necessarily, but I, [00:08:00] I've talked about more recently in just talks I've given or whatever that, yeah, I didn't see myself living past 40. 'cause I was diagnosed when I was 19. 19, 20.
So I didn't know I would, and then now I'm here, I'm 46 and I go, oh, no wonder I didn't plan for this part. So I totally understand, you know, how that, that feeling. But there is something kind of, that gives you an optimism when you live like that for a while or it It gives
you, know,
Mike Nellis: it gives you perspective. Like I, I, I like to joke, I had my midlife crisis in the middle of COVID. Like I had it in my thirties and like, it was very useful. But like, honestly, on an actuarial table, if you look at it like the average man in America only lives to 72 and like, I'm 38, so like, technically based on statistics...
now I don't drink, I don't smoke. Like there's, you know, I'm probably, hopefully gonna live longer than that, but. You never know. Like I, you get hit by a car tomorrow, so like I'd rather live life that way. So,
Rabiah Coon (host): yeah. No, very, well, very cool. And yeah, so I think going off of that subject though, and just going to talking about your Substack and the work you're doing. [00:09:00] Uh, and I've watched, you know, some of your videos and seen what you're doing and it is good 'cause it's a perspective, a little bit different perspective than you're gonna get on the news for sure.
'cause you're talk who you're talking to, who your guests are. So can you just talk a little bit about what the content is because I do wanna encourage people to go check
Mike Nellis: So the, the tagline for me, which I did not come up with, but I do use. is that I'm the no bullshit democratic strategist. and you'll find that, uh, democratic strategists are a dime a dozen on the internet.
There's a lot of people that are like, yeah, I know how to help Democrats win an election and be like, here, let me tell you why Democrats suck. And like, it's a very easy topic over the last year, I too think Democrats suck. So like I'm not, uh, averse to that. But the difference is, and I'll just be perfectly honest with you, like on cable news and on social media, the nber of times I see a person whose title is "Democratic strategist," who's giving people like me advice on M-S-N-B-C or CNN or something, and I've never freaking heard of them when I've been doing this for 20 years, kind of annoys me.
And like, really honestly, like [00:10:00] other than the big names that you know, like, uh, you know, like a David Plouffe and a, and a, you know, James Carville and stuff like that. Like those are guys who have actually done something like the, the gap between them and anybody else is, is sort of gone. So for 20 years I've been working on some of the biggest races in politics and, and you hadn't heard of me and I got, kinda got dragged out.
It's a separate story, but I got dragged out into the public eye due to a right wing conspiracy theory and then got into a fight with Jim Jordan, who's the chair of the House Judiciary Committee, and he's a crackpot. And he and I got into a very public view. Then suddenly I had all this followers and I was like, well, okay, well I might as well see what I can do with it. But I, I hate, hate people who claim they have the answers to win when they've never been in the arena. And so I was like, all right, I'm gonna put myself in the arena. I'm gonna come into your arena now. I'm gonna question what you're saying. 'Because a lot of the times they give people advice that, that's bad in my opinion. And so, and I'm, and I'm not like a party hack either.
Like, I think people hear Democratic strategist, they asse that I'm on like the DNC payroll and I'm in like some secret cabal meeting. It's like, no, I'm a consultant. My job is to recruit candidates, get them to run for office, build their digital infrastructures, do digital [00:11:00] advertising for them. I run Authentic, which is one of the largest digital fundraising and advertising firms in the Democratic party space. I joke that if you've ever gotten a fundraising email from a Democratic candidate and you liked it, I wrote it. But if you didn't like it, I had nothing to do with it. , so, and we can get into a little bit of that too if you want at some point.
, but so what you get on, on Substack is you get unfiltered takes from me about what's going on in politics. What the Trp administration is doing, and why it's bad. What Democrats should be doing in response to that, and how like people individually can be responding and reacting in their life. And so to me it's, we're just trying to like make sense of what the hell's going on that day.
And I tell my community all the time, they help me make sense of it, almost just by hope, probably more than I do. Like I feel like I'm processing stuff in real time. Like the, my, my favorite and I say favorite in the context of, you know, everything's horrible right now. Lemme be clear. At least to me. I think every, I think most things are pretty bad right now.
, during the height of the ICE stuff here in Chicago, so not what's happening in Minneapolis, I wrote a piece where I was reflecting [00:12:00] about how you know, I lived for 20 years basically with a physical disability of being so heavy that I couldn't, you know, walk up a flight of stairs without needing like a 10 minute break.
And now I'm physically active. I can, I've completed 8, 8 and 10K's and stuff like that. And I, and I, you know, I'm doing well. And I was reflecting on like, man, there's all this shit going on. And like, it's so easy for me to feel like I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm doing something when I'm sitting in my basement, and I'm writing these rants and I, and I'm, and I'm talking to you on these Substack lives and, you know, and I just sent this thing out and it was, I should, I should add too, maybe it's a little rambly, I apologize.
On Substack, I basically have two types of content. I go live and I shoot episodes and I talk with my audience and I bring on guests and we have conversations. So we've had senators on and DNC chair, Ken Martin and celebrities like Sean Astin from Lord of the Rings, and Rudy and stuff like that. And then, I have, uh, people do newsletters on Substack, right?
So your typical newsletter is like, you know, welcome to this edition of the Daily where blah, blah, blah, blah, Michael Barbaro, or some version of that, right? just wanted to get that Michael Barbaro crack in there. . My newsletter's not like [00:13:00] that. So my, I use my newsletter more like a blog where I'm like, I have these people who wanna hear what I have to say.
I'm not gonna write the most perfect, curated, same structure thing every time. I'm gonna crack open a Google Doc. and I'm gonna rant. And then I'll clean it up a little bit. And I have some folks who are graciously over here on the side who kind of help me out with that a little bit. But like a lot of it's very raw outta my head.
Clean it up a little bit, get it out. And so sometimes when you're reading something that I've written, I wrote it 20 minutes ago. So I, so the day that I was reflecting on like not using my body, I wrote this thing that was like, I feel bad about not using my body. Like there's people out there who are struggling and suffering and I wanna do that.
And then the response I got was so incredible that it inspired me and gave me ideas to go out and do that. And I helped started to coordinate the like counter ICE response in Chicago around some of the Chicago public schools, particularly one by my house that's like 40% Latino. And so that conversation is what we're having.
And so I think unlike a lot of the other Substack and podcasts that people follow is mine's really raw. It's just me with a mic talking, trying to get my thoughts out the door, trying to be useful and like trying to move at [00:14:00] the same speed that the ecosystem moves in without it being this kind of like, you know, corporate Dems are like overly talking points focused and they're boring and like they don't curse and like, don't have any new ideas and like it's trying to do that, but not going... i'm not like a full, I mean, I worked for Bernie Sanders in 2016.
I love Bernie, but I'm also not like a full like DSA guy. I'm just kind of like a normal Democrat who's sick of the way the party uses power, and want to try to be useful in this moment. This felt like one way I could do it and then it blew up. I didn't expect it to be as big as it is. I'm actually shocked.
Rabiah Coon (host): Okay. So going back really quickly, like 20 years of your career, basically, what got you into doing strategy work in politics and, and what got you like down that path in the first place
Mike Nellis: I, when I was, I, I joke, joke that I never had a childhood, but that's not true. I grew up in like a, you know, really middle class neighborhood in Omaha, Nebraska. Uh, my dad's a ti now retired fBI agent. Mom stayed home. So like pretty normal childhood. I mean, I [00:15:00] can come bitch AAN about X, Y, Z. Can I curse on here?
Okay. I've been so good. That's the first curse word I think I've
tried.
Rabiah Coon (host): well, you just check a box and it says explicit and we're good.
Mike Nellis: You know, not for kids, you know? There we go. but you know, I, so pretty childhood and then, you know, right around the time I'm becoming like, aware of politics and you know, what's going on in the world like George W. Bush is president and 9/11 happens and, you know, they go to war with Afghanistan and I'm young, I'm like 13. And I'm like, okay, fine. Like we've been attacked, these people are there. I get that. Like whatever. And then like a year later they're like, ah, we're gonna go into Iraq now. Like where they got weapons of mass destruction.
I remember that, uh, uh, George Carlin joke from, uh, forever ago where it was like, we, we have the evidence that Iraq has weapons of mass destruction 'cause we saved the receipt. But like I never bought, I never bought the lies and I thought it was really stupid for like people to go over.
, people my age essentially, like they were a little bit older than me going over and fighting a war, which to me seemed like big oil. So like around 15, 16, I started protesting and then, protest movement turned into, okay, it's the presidential election. Bush is gone. so like, who do we want? I got, you know, wrapped up [00:16:00] with Barack Obama.
Like, I was like, Barack Obama's my guy. This is the future. I distinctly remember a neighbor friend of mine, uh, like, like an older woman, just being like, I don't know why you're wasting time with Barack Obama. Guys like that never win. Uh, we're not gonna elect that, we're not gonna elect a black man president named who with his middle name, Hussein.
And I was like, okay, well I don't care about any of that 'cause I'm, because like, again, the future belongs to people who are young and db and like, take risks on stuff and like, that's how you get shit and like, . So I, I, I went off and I, I became like a fellow. Like I basically, like I was in college at this point and I, uh, stopped going to class.
, and just like took like a fellow, which was like a fancy way of saying, we're not gonna pay you. and I was doing like data entry and knocking on doors and really boring stuff. And then eventually parlayed that into my first job. And then on that first job, I was a finance assistant on a Senate race in Nebraska.
And finally getting a little bit of money. And, uh, I hated the job so much 'cause my job was to make sure that the candidate made his phone calls, which to me was like, you're a freaking adult, you should make your phone calls. And then two, it was like, I had to make sure that he get his chewing tobacco and like, clean up after him and get him his lunch and stuff.
And like, I, uh, I am a, I'm, I'm an eight on an [00:17:00] Enneagram, like I hate serving anybody, and don't like, don't really take orders very well. And, uh, so like, I was just bored and I hated it. And so one day somebody was like, hey, the Obama campaign raised a lot of money online. Does anybody wanna figure out how to do that?
And I was like, me, I'll figure it out. Like just gimme literally anything else to do. And then we raised, I don't know, it was probably like a hundred thousand dollars or $200,000. And then, uh, next election cycle, I worked for another Senate campaign. We raised like a million dollars online with the strategies that I built.
So I'm like one of the first people that kind of helped create online fundraising for Democrats, which at the time was extensively in my mind gonna be about responding to Citizens United and you know, being a counter to, you know, corporate influence in politics, which it still kind of is. But now it's become this like gross cesspool of like scams and cons and stuff.
So it's not like far less pure. But that's how I got into this. It was like this deep desire to like end the Iraq war, feeling like it was unfair, feeling like we needed to turn the page with Barack Obama, which we did. And then unfortunately now we're in this situation, so I, you know, I don't know how successful we were, in the, the, in the net-net there, but I don't know.
Rabiah Coon (host): but no, it's [00:18:00] cool and just that you went from really basically volunteering to, to what became your career and now you've pivoted it into something a little bit different than that, but still, you know, all along the same lines of trying to make this party do, do what we, what it's supposed to be doing, really.
I mean, the Democratic party, definitely. And I, I've, I'm registered as a Democrat. There are a few times now, I've almost just, when I've had to change my registration for whatever reason, thought about not checking that box. But it's really hard for me not to do that. I do think that as a voter, I mean especially, and you know, the last election was really rough because we didn't get to pick the candidate really.
And I voted for Kamala Harris and I campaigned for her and I made phone calls and I was in London where I lived, but I, I still did all this stuff, what we were supposed to do, but it was still like really hard. And I think in the end, you know, [00:19:00] hurt us. And I don't know if you think so, I mean, you were more involved certainly, but i, I don't know. And I'm, I'm kind of worried about what we're doing now, right, to change
that.
Mike Nellis: uh, go unpack a couple things there. the first thing is there's not a day goes by where I don't think about registering as an independent. so I, but I, I, I've decided that, it's better to stay and fight and try to fix my party than it is to like abandon it. And like, part of the deep, deep, deep problems that I think America has is that we have, and this is a hot take, we have too many independent voters. and I need some of you to stick around, and help us because like the parties are increasingly being governed by a group of people that you know, I think don't represent the general interest of the vast majority of Americans. Now. I think it's the Democratic party is not as far gone as the Republican Party.
As the Republican Party is off the rails. Like if I became an independent tomorrow, nothing would change about the way I voted. Like I, I cannot stand the MAGA movement. I have very little to no respect Donald Trp. I can kind of like respect the, the game aspect of how he plays, but I hate, like, as an individual, I think he's a man of low moral character, which is generally the nicest thing I say about him.
, and the people he surrounds [00:20:00] himself with are somehow worse. often. I tweeted earlier today that like, I don't think there's ever been a politician I dislike more than JD Vance.
Rabiah Coon (host): yeah.
Mike Nellis: Just like the worst type of politician, like, doesn't believe in anything. Like, is just situational. Outright lie to you.
Like last week he was like, all ice officers have qualified immunity. And then this week he's like, I never said that. And be like, I, here's the tape. he'd be like, that's not me, it's AI. And I'd be like, what? Like, why? And (Rabiah: it's
wild. or say you made a mistake. Like I, I actually appreciate a politician that says they made a mistake.
On, on, on Kamala, Kamala was dealt, in my view, the worst hand of any presidential candidate who's ever run. And, I hated Jake Tapper's book, Original Sin, about the whole situation with, with Joe Biden and his health and the, and the coverup there. But I hated it because like, I only believed half of it. Like it's the most infuriating book I've ever read.
, 'cause it's like half of it's not true, but the other half of it's definitely true 'cause I've heard enough of it from my clients and people that I know.
Rabiah Coon (host): Yeah.
Mike Nellis: but look, they covered up his health. A small group of people who worked around joe Biden covered that up [00:21:00] and, and, and basically like I would. I never worked... I worked for Joe Biden in 2020, but I've, I've never met the man, you know, other than like, maybe like at a meet and greet or something like that where it was just like, quick, hi, how are you? And, I was being lied to by somebody who was being lied to by somebody who was being lied to by somebody who was being lied to. It was like a, the house of cards.
And,
Rabiah Coon (host): Yeah.
Mike Nellis: it's really unfortunate and I wish the party had stepped up, as a whole. But by the way, there's, there's no, this is a misnomer about the Democratic Party. There's no like "Democratic Party". There's like, it's just a loose collection of interests that are just trying to like, move forward in a general way together.
But nobody really stood up to them and said that this was wrong. And so because of that, we got to the debate where Joe Biden had the worst debate I've ever seen. Like I, I genuinely judge now whether or not somebody is serious about winning again in the Trp era, if they can't admit that that was the worst thing they've ever seen with their eyes. Because like, I felt bad for Joe. Like Trp felt bad for Joe. Like, it was like, do you know how bad it has to be for Donald Trp to be restrained? Like, he just was like, like in the beginning of that debate, he was like, I'm backing off. And I've never seen him do that like that. That actually scared the hell outta me. It was like, oh, he has, that's in [00:22:00] him. Like he's doing this on purpose. so it was really scary.
And then. You know, I, I, I think it's easy to say it with hindsight now, but I think what we should have done at that moment, like, forget what happened before that 'cause like, whatever, but at that moment we probably should have had an open convention and, and tried to see what it would've looked like. And, and either Kamala would've been a better nominee or not.
Same thing with the primary. If Joe says, I'm not running like he promised, and then Kamala runs in, in, in 20 - what year is it 2023? I have no clue what year it's anymore. so 2023, God, it's three years ago now. but if Joe Joe says three years ago, I'm not gonna run, and then you have a full year long Democratic primary, we either nominate a better Kamala Harris with a stronger campaign or a different candidate ready to meet the moment, and they nominate Trp again.
And then we win because people hate Trp like. Kamala Harris's favorables were higher than Joe Biden's were. And the truth is what we needed to do was move away from what people were frustrated with, which was Joe. But they didn't want to go back to Trp. They just had two, you know, Andrew Yang said this once, like right after the election, and like people got really mad at him.
But I do think it's right. [00:23:00] It's like American politics is about giving people two shitty choices. They're gonna pick one and it's not that I think Kamala was a shitty choice, but to the average American who's experiencing hyperinflation for a four year period, like, and she can't distance herself from him and she's only had a hundred days to build a campaign, like it doesn't look great.
So, I think that, I think that hurt us and Democrats today are still scrambling. They're still scrambling. And this is like the old, I forget, it was my, it was either Dick Cheney or, one of the other, like Bush goons or something like that, they, they were like, you know, you go to war with the army that you have, not the army that you wanna have.
And like, that's how I approach politics every day. I am like, you know, I don't like a lot of these guys either. Sometimes I don't think they're the best that we have to offer, but like, I don't get to decide who the minority leader is. I don't get to decide, like I go to war with the group, with the team that I have.
I'll fix what I can, where I can and elevate better leaders. Like I, I work for some great young folks like that are amazing. I say young folks, they're probably my age. , but like Mallory McMorrow in, in Michigan. Peggy Flanagan in, in Minnesota, both are running for Senate in their respective states. I've worked for Adam Schiff for [00:24:00] a long time.
I think he's one of the good ones. I worked for John Tester for a long time in Montana, and he lost in his last election, which sucks. But like, I try to work with people that I think are gonna fix it, but then I'll also take on like a tough thing and go, all right, I don't love this person, but like they're our best chance to win.
. You know, so I, I'm trying to fix it where I can and move the party where it needs to go. But like, it's a big party and there's a lot of different active voices and like a lot like this Democrats are probably about to, You know, cut off this appropriations funding bill that the Republicans are moving forward, because it, it, uh, funds, uh, DHS and ICE, right?
And I think that's a hundred percent the right call. But some of the conversation I've been having with like other content creators like me, and a lot of them are more to the left of me, or at least, , maybe, I wouldn't say they're more to the left of me, but they're more unfettered from, uh, electoral politics than I am.
, which nothing was wrong with that. . I go like, look, if you make everything in this shutdown fight about abolish ICE, you'll lose a lot of these Democrats in the middle. And they're like, well, that's not right. Those democrats should be with us. And I go, I, I'm with you. [00:25:00] But that these nine senators or whatever it is, these eight senators will freak out if the fight is about abolish ICE.
But if the fight is about getting these ICE agents outta Minnesota and ending the violence and the chaos and the death, we win that fight. And so I'm trying to tell you like what terrain you can fight on, where it's politically sustainable. And then you can go out and build political terrain that makes it work for somebody to abolish ICE, who's in a state where it's like r plus four.
Trp won that state in the last election and they gotta run for reelection. So I'm very strategic in the way that I think and the advice that I give, Which makes me a little bit different of a content creator. And then the other thing is like, I also work on the races. Like I'm working on, like my firm is doing like 50 or 60 races total.
, I'm probably like seriously involved in like six. so like, I'm actively like giving advice like this weekend, like I've been working, I've been, I've worked eight days straight now. and, and by the way, I'm not the victim of what's happened this last week. I don't want to be seen as, saying that.
Yeah, but like, I'm fucking tired. and like, but like on Saturday and Sunday when this happened and I realized it was gonna be big, I did a Substack live. I wrote a newsletter. I did another one. The next day I shot YouTube content. I came to the [00:26:00] office. I had three calls with clients. Like, I was like, boom, boom.
I didn't spend any time with my son this weekend. Like, there was a lot of stuff going on and like. Being a content creator, doing stuff like this, the conversation you and I have, that's my side hustle and it's in, it's increasingly taking up more of my time side hustle. But like, it's just, it's, I'm just a little bit different of a content creator.
'cause I'm actually out, out there doing it and it's sort of, you know, it's, it's like, uh, I, I feel like I'm giving you a lot of like, old adages, but it's like those who can't teach, like, it kind of feels a little bit like that sometimes with some of my, some people in the space, I would say. I don't know. All of whom I love. Like it's not, it's not a criticism of them.
Rabiah Coon (host): Yeah, but it's, there's an easier said than done aspect to things and you can say a lot of things, but doing them is different. And I think too, I mean, I would say I'm not as, I would love to be more left than I am, but I'm also this kind of pragmatist person who goes, well, yeah, we can say all these like big statements and kind of hyperbolic statements about what should be done but the reality is like being able to do [00:27:00] that and yet getting votes and even practically implementing things is a different story. So you can say, you know, let's do X, like say with healthcare, even like I live in England, so I see the NHS, but I also see the NHS getting defunded. I see there's a shortage of doctors.
I see all this stuff happening over here and I, and I think over here they're not getting that the more you do that, the more you're gonna be like the US system. But then in the US I also think practically implementing things as it was over here is gonna be very difficult given the vole of people and the cost and everything.
Although I do think there's enough money,
Mike Nellis: There's plenty. There's plenty of money in this country to do anything you want.
want that
Rabiah Coon (host): so much. There's
Mike Nellis: Well,
Rabiah Coon (host): much money.
Mike Nellis: this is,
my, it's kind of
sorry, to interrupt. Uh, this, this is my, my most common criticism of the Republican Party is that anytime that somebody like me is like, Hey, we should spend money to make sure people have healthcare, or, Hey, we should forgive student loan debt for people. Or, Hey, you know, childcare in this country is ridiculous. Can we please do something about that? Like I have a [00:28:00] 6-year-old, like childcare is insane. and it's, it's like the average, the average annual cost for childcare is like $25-30,000 a year for a family. Like what? Like at that point you're giving away like half your paycheck for the average American to like, just go to work and, and, and what?
It's not even worth it. and people can't afford to live off one income, so it's just, it's, it's a disaster. and, and anytime I say that, Republicans are like, that's socialism. Look at these liberals. They wanna give away your money. Why don't you take responsibility for your life and blah, blah, blah.
But then anytime a big oil company's like, I want access to those oil fields, they're like, we are attacking Venezuela tomorrow. And I'm like,
Rabiah Coon (host): yeah,
Mike Nellis: I want
Rabiah Coon (host): yeah. And it's
Mike Nellis: the government for good.
Rabiah Coon (host): or, oh, our airline's going outta business. Oh, of here's billions
Mike Nellis: And you know
Rabiah Coon (host): Don't worry about it.
worry about it. And
Mike Nellis: to a certain degree like an airline bailout. Like the Wall Street bailout sucked, right? Like in 2009, it was 2008 'cause they passed TARP in 2008. if you pull, the majority of Americans think that Barack Obama passed the Wall Street bailout, which really drives me crazy 'cause he didn't.
He implemented it, but he didn't pass it. he did vote for it in the Senate. So like, but uh, you know, the tarp bailout and stuff like [00:29:00] that, Horrible in the sense that like, these people crashed the economy and now we have to go save it. Like they made themselves too big to fail. but you needed to do that to prop up the economy from getting even worse before we had full scale breadlines everywhere, but there was no bailout for Main Street. There was no bailout for the people who lost their homes. There was no bailout for people who lost their jobs, none of it. And nobody went to prison for it. So it's like at a certain point there's gotta be some give and take here.
Same thing with like a like COVID. Like COVID, they gave out these PPP loans. and then the, the er, uh, the ERTC tax credits, right, with the two of them are the greatest transfers of wealth from the government to already wealthy people that has ever happened in the history of this country. Now, I'm not saying that PPP was a bad idea because there are a lot of people who had mom and pop shops with 10 employees and they used that in the ERTC to keep their businesses open, and that's a good thing. but there were a lot of people who took them outright. Fraud never investigated. A lot of people like, Adam Corolla, who's like a comedian and a podcast
host, , who feuded with on the internet because he's a big MAGA guy.
Like he, and he hates me. [00:30:00] He hates, it's hilarious. Like I don't, I never
Rabiah Coon (host): 'cause him didn't like
Mike Nellis: no, I prefer, I prefer Jimmy Kimmel, but like, uh, you know, he, he stays up late at night and tweets me and like, I'm asleep. Like it's rid, it's a ridiculous like, relationship that he and I have, but like, he took like a four, I forget how much, but it was like a $400,000 PPP loan for a podcast business with two employees and never paid it back.
Had it forgiven. Why? So he gets to keep all of that money and, and meanwhile, like 60% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck and like, it's, it, it's absurd. Like right now, if you have a million dollars, you can pay for a pardon If you commit a crime. So like if you commit a hundred million dollars
Rabiah Coon (host): Oh yeah.
Mike Nellis: fraud case and you get caught and prosecuted, you can just pocket slip a little check at the back of Donald Trp's jacket.
It's an enormous jacket that he wears. And like, 'cause they're ill fitting.
and, Or his
Yeah.
Rabiah Coon (host): do
Mike Nellis: yeah. Or, or like give it, give it to the kid or like, something like that. He's
just, you know,
Rabiah Coon (host): yeah,
Mike Nellis: it's just
Rabiah Coon (host): they're ill-fitting his
Mike Nellis: Ill fitting Ja. Oh, I hate, I hate the, i I
Rabiah Coon (host): Well, it's
Mike Nellis: a, As a frpy, as a frpy man, it annoys me the way that he dresses.[00:31:00]
'cause I just like, I'm like, there's a way to do it. There's a way to wear a suit and look good. And it's not that. So these are not the important issues of the day.
Rabiah Coon (host): No, it's kind of... they're not, but he looks like Muppet Man
Mike Nellis: Also the tie, the length of the ties. We've all just become normalized to that. But I've never seen another han being on the planet dress like that. And I just, I don't know why we're just so okay with that. I, I just dunno, like all these crimes, it's the, it's the least of them, but like, I just like, it's just a fashion
Rabiah Coon (host): yeah, the fashion,
Mike Nellis: And I'm wearing like a hoodie, so like, who am I to judge? But like I, when I wear a suit, I look better than that guy. So, also he's like, I weigh 245 pounds and I'm like, buddy, we weigh the same weight, we're the same weight. You're wearing a, he's
wearing a, he's wearing a girdle, but like, whatever.
Rabiah Coon (host): well, yeah, I weigh as much as Trp and I don't get And I'm like, oh God. If that's not a wake up
Mike Nellis: It's all mu It's all muscle
Rabiah Coon (host): We all have our rock bottom
Mike Nellis: all muscle, eh, you know, whatever.
Rabiah Coon (host): So, so speaking of Trp actually, and I mean, I agree that his fashion is probably the least of the problems. One thing I struggle [00:32:00] with, and I know a lot of people struggle with, and I'm seeing a lot of posts online right now, like if you support Trp or et cetera, you support ICE or whatever, you don't belong in my life and people are just cutting people out. And this has been happening for years and I'm, I have family, and I know you do that. And specifically our dads who are, I think your dad right,
Mike Nellis: Yeah. Oh, yep. All three times. Unbelievable. Unbelievable shit.
And
Rabiah Coon (host): I can like in 80, like in my case, an 86-year-old man who, and I'm not gonna get into why he supports Trp on this podcast, but you know, fine.
Like I can just kind of deal with that. Like I'm not gonna change his mind. I mean, when I was a kid doing campaign stuff and for Clinton, honestly, the, for President Clinton, Bill Clinton, , he, you know, didn't get it then. And he's always hated my politics, so fine. But then I have other people who either aren't saying anything, very suspiciously, not saying anything. So I don't know where they stand, but I can asse, I kind of asse where they stand and I have other people, I know where they stand and it, for me, it's really hard to tolerate, right? And to [00:33:00] even talk to them or even really want to have any relationship with them. But then I also think like that's really not what we can do as Americans.
I mean, at some point the next president, hopefully not a, a MAGA, will have to represent all the people. And I think Trp not representing all the people right now, or not, you know, treating blue states differently and stuff isn't the right thing. So how are you handling both personally and professionally? 'Cause you have conversations with people who don't agree with you at all. How are you handling that?
Mike Nellis: So, uh, let me, lemme do, uh, personal first. I, I sometimes joke about this when you meet somebody that won't talk about politics, it's like I have a, I have a lot of male friends that when you talk about Taylor Swift with them, they'll go like, oh, incredible businesswoman. And I laugh 'cause I'm like, okay, you don't like her music.
Just fucking say that. like, it's fine. She's doesn't have to be for everyone. I like her. I've got my Taylor Swift bracelet on right now. and inevitably somebody will ask me about it. It's for, I think he did it, but I just can't prove it. That's what I wear on my, which is, uh, I think [00:34:00] so adept for my life.
But it's also my favorite Taylor Swift song. I just wanna work. Or I had to work that in somehow. But like, no, it's, uh, so in my personal life, like look, I have a very conservative family. My, my parents are both Republicans. My dad voted for Trp three times. My mom voted for Trp twice. One of the times she was just like, I'm not fucking voting.
, and I respect, I actually respect that decision more. but I, even though I, I truly think people should vote, even if they vote for candidates I don't like, 'cause I'm a bleeding heart liberal at the end of the day. my brothers are, are, you know, are pretty like normal. They're just like normal han beings trying to figure out what the hell to do.
They're not, I don't think they're like ideological. And I should add, like most han beings who don't follow politics at the level that I do, and maybe you do, are not ideological. Like nobody, the average person doesn't care about the difference between socialism and capitalism or leftism or conservatism or MAGA or whatever.
Blue MAGA. I laugh "blue MAGA" is my favorite db term on the democratic side. MAGA versus woke. I guess you wanna do that is the dichotomy.
I don't know.
,
Mike Nellis: I love when people talk about Blue MAGA. That's a whole other conversation because I just think it's really silly. but, uh, most people don't care about that.
Most people are like, can I pay my [00:35:00] bills? Can the government get off my back? Can I take a vacation? Do I feel safe in my community? Are my streets paved? Like I think most politicians get so focused on like other stuff and like broader ideological stuff that they're trying to solve that it's like fix a road.
Like, and I'll give you an example, like Zoran Mandani, this week made sure that the entire city of New York was fully plowed of snow, after the snow storm, and he was out there personally doing it. And I'm like, that's good politics. Like that guy gets it. And I don't agree with him on everything policy wise, but like, man, he gets how to be a politician, particularly an executive.
, and I'm really impressed with him, even if he's not from my quote unquote wing of the party or whatever. And I don't, again, I don't really care about this stuff, but, so for me it's like, okay, I'll, I'll, he's my dad. I only have one dad. I only have one mom. I'll tell anybody, like if you've got a toxic relationship that you need to get out of because that person is, you know, rude or mean to you or like whatever, like get out of it. Like I'm not gonna like lecture you on your situation. But, I do think way too many you know, uh, liberals, democrats, whatever, are too quick to cut out anyone in their life who doesn't vote the way that they want to. And I think it's [00:36:00] hurtful because like, one, communication is the communication and community are the bedrocks of a functional democracy, and we're already being pulled apart from each other in so many different ways. And the, these tech billionaires have created so many tools that you never have to leave your house to do anything.
, and so like people have replaced, like going out to a bar and hanging out with their friends and like having a drink and being a han being with playing video games and Reddit comments. And I don't even have to go to the grocery store and have an awkward conversation with somebody because I can just order it on DoorDash and not notice the 25% upcharge that I'm being charged.
It's why,. It's why people think their burrito costs $30. If you go to, if you go to Chipotle, it's only like 13 bucks, which is still too much for a burrito, but it's not 30 bucks. So like.
Right people or, or, and you know, so, and I, I remind, I remind people all the time, it's like, the invention of the ATM machine, I dunno if you know this story.
The guy who invented it, specifically invented it because he hated conversations with people while standing in line to get money at the bank. So he created an efficiency. So that won't happen anymore. But like if the primary motivation for a lot of [00:37:00] these like awkward tech billionaires is I don't want to deal with people and now the whole world has been optimized for that. People are, it's no, no wonder that like anxiety, depression, suicide are like higher than they've ever before. Drug abuse, alcohol abuse, so much higher. Deaths to despair off the charts, particularly for, for men. white men in this country, by the way, are four times more likely to commit suicide than any other group of people in the country. And nobody ever talks about that other than Scott Galloway. so it's, I think that's a problem. And so we are isolating ourselves, so don't isolate yourself more from the family. You only get one family. And so, and again, you have toxic family members, get them out. I get it. , the, the second reason I, I, I think it's as important is like, and friends too.
Like, I don't think you have to like, ditch a friend because they voted a way that you like
Rabiah Coon (host): Yeah.
Mike Nellis: one of my best friends, total Gun nut, voted for Trp. Like, it just is what he is. I'd leave, I'd leave my kid with him. I probably make sure he didn't have any of his guns on him. I'm a gun owner too, but like, it's, you know, I, he's a good dude. and I, I try to evaluate that separate from politics because people make decisions that are irrational in politics. But also, and I think this is super important for the left to not get in an echo chamber. How the hell do you know what [00:38:00] you actually believe in if you never talk to somebody who disagrees with you?
Like, I'm such a sharper strategist in my opinion, because I have my dad and my mom who will give me their perspectives and like, I think they're batshit crazy like half the time. But now I know a little bit more and I communicate a little bit more when I'm doing a race and I'm forced to like, you know, steel sharpens steel, iron sharpens iron, whatever the phrase is.
, I feel like I've given you so many like BS like, you know, business school phrases that I have on this podcast, so I'm gonna sound like one of those guys. But like, I'm better because of that. I'm better because of my friends. I'm better because I, and, and you, you alert, you alluded to it, in the professional side of this conversation, but like, I go on a lot of right wing TV and I do Piers Morgan and I do Fox News and I do News Nation.
I do Newsmax and I go on podcasts. And like part of the reason I do that is because one, nobody else does it In the Democratic Party, we were like, oh, well screw Fox News. They're, you know, racist and horrible and blah, blah blah. So we just won't go there and be like, highest cable audience, largest cable audience in the world.
So the left withdrew themselves from having tough conversations with people. And then on top of that, we stopped creating new [00:39:00] voices of people who could go in there and talk. Like the, the conversation around Harris going on Joe Rogan's podcast, which has been talked to death and I blame myself half for half the reason it's been over death 'cause I brought it up a ton 'cause I thought she should have done it.
But like the other thing is like she didn't have any surrogates on the left TM trademark that could go on a podcast like that or Theo Von or one of these others in this new media environment and talk, except for Mark Cuban and maybe Pete Buttigieg. That was it. There was nobody else that could do it. And it's annoying because there should be like 30 people that could go do that.
And Trp had that. Trp had all kinds of people that would go for him. Celebrities, musicians, politicians, all kinds of stuff himself. He did, he was doing the Undertaker's podcast for pro wrestling, uh, hall of Fame legend. And like, you know, sometimes I just wanna listen to the Undertaker's podcast and think about nineties pro wrestling and not have Donald Trp down my throat.
But I can't do that because like twice I had to deal with that in 2024. So like, where was my Kamala Harris version of that? Like, so you can't tell me they couldn't have found other people and curated that. Now they didn't have enough time, but the party as a whole didn't curate that. And we think we can win without talking to you. And I [00:40:00] think that's really stupid.
And there's one more thing I'll add on, add on top of that. Like I'm, I'm a huge fan of The Simpsons and there's an episode where Ned Flanders reminisces about his parents and his parents are like beatnik hippies that don't believe in punishment for kids.
And so they go, and Ned is like a terror and like never listens to anything that they say. And they go to a therapist and, and they, the dad says to the therapist, "we've tried nothing and we're all out of ideas." And that's the Democratic Party on men every election. Our nbers with men are horrendous and the conversation is always on our side, like, what's wrong with men? Why are white men so bad? Why are black and brown men, you know? Why do they hate Kamala Harris? Are they sexist? Are they racist? Like, what is it? And I'm like, I'm sure some of that is true. I'm not gonna pretend like it's not. But did you say anything to them? Did you center your, their issues in your campaign? Did you go talk to them? Did you organize in those communities? Did you create surrogates that could go talk to them? You didn't. So like no shit. The Republicans spend an unbelievable amount of time appealing to young men, and by the way, now they're floundering with that because what do young [00:41:00] men want?
Jobs. Economic opportunity. A house. Like groceries and a mate. That's what like young men want. And so now they can't get any of that because everything's even more screwed up than it was before. So much so that like people are missing joe Biden and like at the end of Biden's presidency, he was as unpopular as Jimmy Carter was. Historically unpopular president.
So I just, Democrats need to show up and they're doing a better job now of it. And it's one of the reasons I'm, I'm doing this is so I can go in those spaces and be like, Hey, let me talk to you a little bit, , about this stuff. And, and I think it works more often than not, but you know, it's something that compounds.
And the other thing is, I'm sorry I'm ranting so you tell me when you wanna take the back, but, you get people that, like when I do these. Like when I go on Newsmax and Newsmax is crazy, I'm doing newsmax tomorrow. They're crazy. And you know, they'll go, you're not gonna win those people over. You're not gonna win all those people over. I'm like, hold on. I know I'm not gonna win those people over. I know that when I go on Newsmax or when I do Jesse Waters, I'm the heel. Okay. Jesse Waters is the face. Okay. I don't agree with that, [00:42:00] but like do you think Thanos thought he was the bad guy in Avengers Infinity War? He didn't. But you get people thinking and you get people talking and you treat them with respect.
And that 5 to 10% of that audience that's like, Hey, yeah, everything is more expensive right now. What's that about? Like they get, some people get there and a fraction of a fraction of movement. Like if you just moved like one or 2% of white dudes in this country, like Donald Trp could never be elected again.
, because the other thing I, I have to remind people all the time 'cause Democrats are again in a bubble and people, han beings as a whole are bad at understanding the, the, like, the nbers and the structures of society is twice as many white men in raw nbers voted for Kamala Harris than black women.
Now, black women voted for Kamala Harris, like 90 to 10. And you know, Kamala won like 41% of white men or something like that. but that's how many white men there are in this country. I'm like, go communicate with them in their spaces. Don't abandon anybody. Like, I'm not sitting here going, you know, oh, we're gonna, it's, I'm okay losing, you know, 10% of black women if we go do this.
And I'm not saying that. It's like we, it should be yes, and. We should be able to do both. We should walk and chew g. [00:43:00] And Democrats are kind of afraid to have those conversations. It's like I'm, again, I'm, I just keep ranting. I'm sorry, but like I'm, I'm one of the founders of "White Dudes for Harris". and when we did White Dudes for Harris, a lot of people were like, oh my God, you can't organize white people on a Zoom call.
What are you gonna do? Are you doing a klan rally in support of Kamala Harris? I'm like buddy, If we're doing Black Women for Harris and we're doing Black, uh, we're doing Black Men for Harris, we're doing Hispanic Men... you have to tell white men that they have a seat at the table too. Otherwise they're gonna go to the only party that appeals to them.
And so, like, as cringey as that call was at times, and like, I was not fully in control of everything that happened on the call. Like I love Joseph Gordon Levitt, but maybe him high from his cabin like talking about Kamala Harris was maybe not something I would've put on tv. No offense to JG. But like, you know, it's, there's some stuff I would've done, but like it was moving the ball forward. And I would note as well, 'cause people like to rag on me for this, Kamala Harris did do marginally better with white men than Joe Biden did four years prior. Just wanted to get that out there. 'cause no, nobody's interested in that nuance, but I would like to tell [00:44:00] people it was 1% wasn't great, but like it was 1%.
So Yeah. Yeah.
Rabiah Coon (host): you
Mike Nellis: I'll die on that hill. You could put it in my
Rabiah Coon (host): that's uh.
Mike Nellis: So whenever I die, former senior advisor, White Dudes for Harris, he apologized to anyone who was upset about it, but would like to note Kamala Harris did do 1% better with white men in that election.
Rabiah Coon (host): Amazing. We can italicize it. One thing I like to ask every guest is just, do you have any advice or mantra you'd like to share with people, maybe just something you live by or?
Mike Nellis: I have a ton mantras. I'm a big, we're a big affirmation family in the Nellis household. I have a little 6-year-old, you could invite my 6-year-old on. He'll tell you all of them. It's hilarious. he, he will, he will coach them back to me when I'm frustrated about something. But like, I'm on like, you know, 1% better every day.
So I'm trying to just sort of, you know, nick, nick, nick forward every day and, and create a little bit of progress. And knowing that like, there's gonna be days where everything sucks and it just feels like I'm making no moment. And then it, you know, lightening., I have another phrase like that is like "famine, [00:45:00] famine, feast".
, and social media's a lot like that. Like, you know that as a content creator, like, you know, I, I have days where I'm like, man, nothing's performing well, and everybody hates me and the algo are mad at me and I've lost my step. And it'll be like, the next day it'll be like, p everything's great. and I gain 10,000 followers or whatever.
It's, so it's just like, just keep going. Like, don't give up is, is a big one for me. I'm also, there's two other quotes I'll give you that are, that are important to me. So I'm a big James Clear Atomic Habits guy. I think Atomic Habits is the best book I've ever read. I attribute it to a large part of the reason A, that I'm as productive as I am as a, as a han being. But also, B, it, it's the reason I was able to lose all this weight was reading that book was, you know, identity based habits and stuff like that. But he has a quote that's you, "you don't rise to the level of your goals, you fall to the level of your systems." And as an eight on the Enneagram, as we talked about earlier, like, I'm a mess when it comes to systems and processes, and I probably have AD-, I probably have undiagnosed ADHD, and like systems are not my first go-to, but if I build a system myself, I can follow it. And if I can follow that system, I can ideate and improve it over time. So like I know that now, and so like now [00:46:00] I fall to the level of my systems and so shit gets done.
, and when I was a kid. I couldn't, you know, like Right. Even right now, like if you tell, like my wife is like, will you take the trash out later? I'll go, sure. And then I'll immediately forget about it, like five seconds later and she'll get mad at me. But if I write it down and I, I have a, I have a whole, I used to have carry a notebook, physical notebook with me everywhere. And then I, I turn that into like a, a full Notion setup that I have. So I have a full like, action-priority matrix.
And Tiago Forte is a creator that people should check out who does a lot of like, on YouTube. Systems and processes for like your second brain. He is got a book on it. It's really good. so I do a lot of that and it's super useful. And then. The third thing I'll, I'll tell people is, uh, Mark Manson's book, the Subtle Art of Not Giving a Fuck, is amazing. If you'd like to get to the point, you know, where, maybe not where I'm at 'cause who would wanna be where I'm at, but like, you know, I get yelled at by Jesse Waters or like Laura Loomer or like Donald Trp and like, I don't give a shit. Like, fuck whatever. I'd probably be excited by that at this point. but you know, is he has a quote that is, "the pursuit of the positive is inherently negative".
Paradoxically, embracing the negative is positive. And [00:47:00] so like I, which is just like a fancy way of saying like, embrace the suck. Like things that suck can be good for you and don't wake up every morning looking for things to be good for you. Find the good in everything around you. And so that keeps me to be like, as Kamala Harris would say, and I borrowed this as one of my core values, is, is "joyful warrior".
Like she would, she would say that all the time. She'd be like, I'm a joyful warrior. We're joyful warriors. This is a shitty time. We're gonna make our way through it. And like, that's, it's one of the core values for the business, for the content creation business is like joyful warrior. We're gonna hang it on the, on a wall over here because like, I, I don't, I'm not, I refuse to be miserable.
I refuse to be made miserable for four years of this administration. Like, I, I'm not gonna do it, especially when I have like a 6-year-old boy at home, like, I wanna, these are core years. I'm not gonna get them back. So like, I'm gonna enjoy my life and I'm gonna be as useful as I can. So that's roughly where it's.
Rabiah Coon (host): Awesome. Yeah, and joyful warrior is one of my favorite things that she said too. Well, thanks for that. So the last thing is just have the fun five.
Rabiah Coon (host): There are five questions that we can just go through and they're fun for some of us. So one, [00:48:00] question one is, what's the oldest T-shirt you still have?
Mike Nellis: The oldest t-shirt I have. I don't have any old t-shirts because I've lost so much weight. I got to throw 'em all away. In fact, like two or three weeks ago, I threw away six or seven trash bags full of clothes that did not fit. So I'm gonna, instead, I'm gonna like retake the question to tell you about the newest t-shirt that I have, which is a hoodie that I bought, uh, at the Zack Brown concert at The Sphere last weekend that my wife took me to.
Rabiah Coon (host): Oh, nice. And at The Sphere. Yeah. That's supposed to be so awesome.
Mike Nellis: Which then I immediately spilled like oil on it while I was cooking the other day. So, yeah, we got it out though. It's okay. We moved. We have a system for when I spill now. It's very helpful.
Rabiah Coon (host): Amazing. Good
Mike Nellis: Systems are good.
Rabiah Coon (host): if every day was Groundhog's Day, um, , like Bill Murray, the Bill Murray movie, what song would you have wake you up every morning?
Mike Nellis: It would probably be like a Zach Brown band song. Like, there's so many that I like, he's got what's new one? Give It Away Is like the new song that they have. It's actually the anthem of the college football playoffs this year. So I've heard it like a thousand times this year.
but I really like that song. [00:49:00] I, there's a bunch that he has, like, I, I tend to listen to a lot of Zach Brown Band. They're like my go-to. It's funny 'cause I mentioned Parks and Rec earlier, but you know, how, have you seen the show?
So when, when, when Ben Wyatt is depressed, he wears a a t-shirt of like letters from Cleo.
So my version of that is like The Fray. When I'm miserable and depressed, I listen to The Fray, but when I'm happy, which is most of the time I listen to Zack Brown Band. And then like in the middle it's like nothing like other than like anytime somebody's like, you wanna hear this new song? I'll be like, sure.
'cause like I've discovered Japanese Breakfast. I dunno if you've heard of them. I love Japanese Breakfast. They're so good. So they're, my staff are laughing at me right now.
Rabiah Coon (host): They need to, look, they need to take us seriously. We're
Mike Nellis: because I'm old doesn't mean I can't enjoy young, hipster, cool zoomer music. Okay.
Rabiah Coon (host): Yeah, you can actually.
Mike Nellis: Kids today.
Rabiah Coon (host): I know these kids. I know. And they're, they probably are. I mean, I'm 46, so they're young. Alright, third one. Coffee or tea or neither?
Mike Nellis: I've never, I've never had, I've never had tea. Well, I've had tea, but I don't really like it. And I've [00:50:00] never really been a coffee guy. I've gimme a Coca-Cola at noon with lunch any day.
Rabiah Coon (host): All right, nice. All right, can you think of a time that you like laughs hard, you cried or something that always cracks you up?
Mike Nellis: Hmm
I mean, the two stupid things that come to mind, like my son's hilarious, like just like my son is the largest vocabulary of it. It's not a brag, it's the largest vocabulary of a 6-year-old I've ever heard. I laugh so hard anytime he appropriately correctly uses a big word. And I'm always just, he'll be like, dad, that's, you're being facetious right now.
And I'll be like, shut the fuck up. Who talks like that? I don't talk like that. Like so like where did you get that
Rabiah Coon (host): Yeah.
Mike Nellis: from, and then, you know what really cracks me up, and it's so db, but like, I love bad trpet impersonations, like, and I have one and it's like America, Hillary Clinton. She's terrible. I hate her.
You know? And then so like in my life, what cracks me up is like walking around the office and like, just taking any conversation that we're in and be like, be like, oh, they're making chicken, chicken in the crockpot. A lot of people say crockpot. I choose, I say Instapot. You know, it's like shit like that. And like, it's not good, but like, you know what I'm doing. So it's like, uh, I
Rabiah Coon (host): is fun. Yeah, it's fun for you. Yeah. [00:51:00] Yeah. Well, just how he always says, you might call it whatever, and it's like, that's what it's called
Mike Nellis: Oh, I go a lot of people, a lot of people are saying I might deserve the Nobel Peace Prize. A lot of people, I'm not saying it, but a lot of people, you know,
you know, Yeah.
stupid. He's, he's ridiculous. But God damnit, he's
funny. It's like George W. Bush. Like George W. Bush was horrible, but God damnit. He was
funny. America.
Rabiah Coon (host): Well, the thing he had too is he's handsome. Like as he got older, like a lot of women were like, oh God, why? You know? Like, were so annoyed. Chelsea Handler talked about that, how
Mike Nellis: If we're talking about politicians that got handsomer, the older that they are, can we talk about Mitt Romney? 'cause that guy's an absolute fox, like just
absolute fox. It's unbelievable. I can only hope to age that well. I'm gonna spend the rest of my life trying to make sure that I have the exact right amount of gray to recreate his haircut when I'm like 60 years old.
Unbelievable. I hated him in 20, I love him now, but like in 2012 when he was running against Obama, I hated him, but I, I was just so, I'm bi so like all the time I was just like, mm-hmm. Wouldn't vote for him, Mitt Romney could get it.
Rabiah Coon (host): See, we have more in common, so Yeah. But yeah,
he, he has.
Mike Nellis: For [00:52:00] Alderman and somebody's gonna find that exact clip and take it out to embarrass the shit out of me, and I can't wait.
So, to, to the, uh, researcher who found this. Congratulations.
Rabiah Coon (host): Good. And thank you for acknowledging good SEO, right? And then, and then the last one, the last question, Who inspires you right now?
Mike Nellis: Who inspires me? It's such a cop out right now to say this, but I, I really do mean it is like anybody putting their body on the line right now with ICE agents out there outta control. Like at, like Alex Pretti, the man who was murdered in Minneapolis, just recording, just docenting and, and lost his life for it and. How do you not be somewhat inspired about that? Like, I, I just, it's horrible, but like, and then people keep showing up and they keep showing up and they keep showing up and like, and I'll keep showing up too. So it's like I just, I think it's, it's probably that. And then, you know, my wife is the toughest SOB I've ever met and she's been through so much, so like it's, you know, that too, which is both cliched answers, but like I, that is what I have, so
Rabiah Coon (host): No, they're great. Yeah. [00:53:00] All right, cool. Uh, so then where do you want people to go to find you?
Mike Nellis: Yeah. , uh, just endless urgency dot com (endlessurgency.com) or find me on any major social media platform. We're, we're building up our YouTube big right now. We're about to hit 10K, after launching a couple weeks ago.
Rabiah Coon (host): Awesome. Okay. Yeah, and those links will be in the show notes. Well, Mike, thanks so much. It was a lot of fun to do this and also like super informative. I appreciate you.
Mike Nellis: This was a blast. Happy to do it. Best of luck.
Rabiah Coon (host): Cool. Thank you.
Thanks for listening. You can learn more about the guest and what was talked about in the show notes. Joe Maffia created the music you're listening to. You can find him on Spotify at Joe M-A-F-F-I-A. Rob Metke does all the design for which I'm so grateful. You can find him online by searching Rob, M-E-T-K-E.
Please leave a review if you like the show and get in touch if you have feedback or guest ideas. The pod is on all the social channels at at More Than Work Pod (@MoreThanWorkPod) or at Rabiah Comedy (@RabiahComedy) on TikTok. While being kind to others, don't forget to be kind to [00:54:00] yourself.
