S4E4 - Claire Waite Brown
This week’s More Than Work Podcast guest is Claire Waite Brown. Founding “Open Stage Arts” and then “Creativity Found” were pivotal to her as she looked to forge a path that was truly her own outside of work. After attending university and studying contemporary dance she ended up editing non-fiction illustrated books for a living while raising a family.
At about 40, Claire studied to become a fitness dance instructor. She now also does street dance continuing to pursue her passion for movement in a different way.
When she founded Open Stage Arts, Claire created a space and community for adults to try something new like acting without all the drama of am-dram and other classes. It was also something she created for herself rather than something she was doing for others. Next came her website and podcast, Creativity Found where she interviews other artists and helps them showcase their work.
Rabiah and Claire stop laughing periodically to have a conversation!
Transcript
Rabiah (Host): [00:04:13] Hey, welcome back everyone. I, once again, I'm excited to bring you this episode. It's actually episode 51. So I didn't say anything in the pre recording part of the last episode with Dave Wiener, but it was episode 50 and it's pretty fitting, considering. Just when I met him in my career and how important that meeting was to me.
I don't even think he realized it at all, but he's someone I really followed and respected a lot, especially when I was working in that space, the warehouse management space, but. Anyway this week, I have Claire Waite Brown. She is someone that lives in England, who I've actually met in person. I haven't met most of my guests in person, honestly.
But. She's one that I have, and we. I really like having people from England on sometimes just because of the differences in our language. And if we can connect on that and. I think we had a really fun conversation at the very end, just about misunderstandings between Americans and [00:05:13] British people and the words we use. So,
I think it's a really fun episode. What I think people might get out of it is that. First of all, it's never too late to do something. Uh, she pursued dance when she was in university, they call it uni here, by the way. And then that didn't really work out for her as a career. So she ended up pursuing another career and around age 40, she went back to start teaching dance and now part of her- the way she's fulfilling herself and the activity she's doing is. Her podcast, creativity found. And, and kind of empowering others to be more visible with their art, but then also she founded her own arts company as well.
And it's just really cool to see how she didn't let it go. She didn't let go of the things she wanted to do. She just turned them into basically things she could do in a different way. And that's really neat because I think a lot of times. [00:06:13] we'll think we want to pursue something like, say for example, if I said, oh, I wanted to be a writer, which is absolutely true and something I had trouble admitting to myself for a long time.
And it didn't work out the way I thought it might, but it's something. I'm doing in my job now. I have to change my intro to the podcast. I'm no longer an it project manager. But it's just to show that if you're open to things happening and you're willing to make maybe changes or you're willing to see things a different way.
You really can start to pursue those dreams maybe that you had, or those hobbies that you weren't sure about. So, that's what I got from it. That's what I hope you get. And something else too. That'd be great. If you get something else from it. It's a really fun chat. I think I'm going to leave it at that. Again, if you have guest ideas, you have feedback. You just want to tell me
anything really morethanworkpod@gmail.com. And you can also rate, review, like, subscribe. There are all kinds of things you can do. [00:07:13] So do any of those. Thanks so much for listening and enjoy the show
Welcome to More Than Work, the podcast reminding you that your self worth is defined by more than your job title. I'm Rabiah, an IT Project Manager, comedian, nonprofit volunteer, and sometimes activist. Every week, I'll chat with a guest about pursuing passions outside of work or creating meaningful opportunities inside the workplace.
As you listen, I hope you'll be inspired to do the same. Here we go. .
Hey everyone. This week, my guest is someone I met, basically online on an app during lockdown. There were a lot of us in England and elsewhere using Clubhouse. And it's an app I'm not using that much anymore, but it's just an audio app. And so I ended up in [00:08:13] some creative, like creative person groups, and she was in one of them and we've gotten to know each other and she even came to see me do comedy, which was awesome.
So it's Claire Waite brown. She's a podcaster and founder of Creativity Found. How are you doing?
Claire Waite Brown: I'm very well, thank you. How are you?
Rabiah (Host): Good. Good. Thanks. So, um, can you just introduce yourself a little bit and tell people where I'm talking to you from? So I'm in London and where are you?
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah. Okay. So I'm in Oxford. Just outside of Oxford in my little office. And as you mentioned, I've recently started the podcast and developing that now under the name of Creativity Found and yeah, that's where I am.
Rabiah (Host): Awesome. Let's just start off with, what is Creativity Found?
Claire Waite Brown: Okay. So basically I started the podcast, which was born out of something else I was doing that I started later in life. And [00:09:13] doing that thing it's basically theater arts classes for adults. It's called Open Stage Arts. And the idea was that that was just for the fun of it. A bit of singing and a bit of drama without the politics of maybe joining and Am-dram theater company. Not having to learn lines, not having to audition, just hopefully a bit more relaxed and just for the, for the fun of it. Um, while doing those classes and meeting the people coming to those classes, I started to come across people who were similar to me and that they were looking to get back a creative, something that they may have had when they were younger and that they may have lost while working, bringing up children, whatever the stresses and strains or normality of everyday life. And often creativity can be the first thing that gets pushed to the side because other things are more important. So when we got into lockdown and I wasn't doing those [00:10:13] live classes anymore, um, somebody out there, a very wise person said, oh, you've got lots of stories.
She was talking about podcasts and I had no intention of podcasting at all. And she said, oh, but you've got lots of content. And it was then that this idea clicked. There are people out there who have very different stories about their creative discipline and how they were able to get back to it as adults.
So I had a few friends that I already knew with these kinds of stories. So I started with them and it's basically grown. Since then, and I've just met some wonderful people who have all sorts of stories of the kind of triggers that maybe got them. Sometimes there'll be triggers such as ill health, um, that or burnout or stress that then make them realize,
I need to chill out a bit and I need to give a bit more for myself. Others it will be maybe like I'm doing [00:11:13] this, but I'm just not feeling happy. I'm just not content. And then finding that it's this creative thing they want to do that makes them happy. So that's been absolutely wonderful. So I've been chatting to all these lovely artists and creatives of all disciplines, and then it occurred to me that.
It would be lovely to connect the listener or people in general with ways that they can do what the. What my guest has done. So maybe workshops, maybe exhibitions, maybe subscription boxes or, or just books or some way to say, look, here's some ideas that you can try. So,I'm expanding on the whole Creativity Found concept by now, bringing out, bringing together
facilitators who can put their course- because there are loads of wonderful people out there teaching adults to do weaving and making hats [00:12:13] and teaching you to play piano, but in a lovely way that isn't like learning scales and all the scary ways. So Creativity Found is a kind of community, that's going to amalgamate all those sort of creative pursuits that that grownups can do in a safe
place and feel relaxed and happy and calm because it can be quite scary for grownups to go and try new things, but hopefully people can be encouraged by the guests that I speak to on the podcast. And then, you know, to give it a go themselves as well.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, that's cool. And I just had so many thoughts while you were saying all this, because I have friends who, you know, they have kids and their kids are kind of, of school age now. And they're starting to find that they've lost parts of themselves during that process. And you have, you know, that as a mom is also
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. And then they go and do creative things. I have one friend who does, and she's the listener, so I am mentioning her, but she does like, um, etching. Right? And she'll go [00:13:13] do a class for that. And she's an Oregon and she's a great artist. And then I have another friend who's just gone through some stuff in the past year and he just started drawing and he forgot that he drew, as
crazy as it sounds you can do something, but he used to draw very long time ago as a kid. And now he's like in his forties and he just started drawing and it's amazing. And so I think there is that need to find that again, right?
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah. And like I said earlier often gets put on the back burner when other things become more important. Like you say about children. I mean, my daughter is 20 now and my son is 15, but when they're young, you life is full of probably work. Children and family stuff. Um, but also I tended to have quite a good social circle than because there were the other parents and you were busy doing things.
You go into toddler groups or school and doing stuff like that. And I've found that when my [00:14:13] children got older, I lost some of those social connections as well. So starting Open Stage Arts, for example, which if you think of it as kind of modeled on the kind of performing arts classes that children can do. The Saturday schools and that's kind of what I wanted to replicate. By doing that, I, I got a whole social life back again as well. So there's there is that finding something. I mean, I used to dance. I did dance for a degree and I just got back into really loving doing those exercises, even though I'm not performing in front of an audience- well I am, you know, the people in class, but that connection with performance that I've, that I've always loved.
Rabiah (Host): Even with the dance, then when you think about you were a dancer to the point where you got a degree in it and were doing performance, and then at some point that stopped. I know when people have those kinds of careers and they stop, sometimes you do end up not enjoying it anymore .
And so coming back to [00:15:13] it, that you were able to enjoy it. Can you talk a little bit about like were you apprehensive in coming back to that at all?
Claire Waite Brown: No. And I think another thing that comes to mind actually is that also people will completely block it off. If they can't do it, then they didn't want anything to do with it at all. So I certainly had one of my guests really enjoy drama as a child, but it was made apparent to her by her parents, which is another thing, parental pressure, societal pressure that can stop you doing what your hear wants to do. And because she wasn't doing theater, she completely stopped it. I don't want anything to do with it at all. And then she was quite brave to come back to trying it again. I mean, for me, it was never not there. It just wasn't there in a big way. So for example, we used to do aerobics classes and that, that has a bit of that in there.
And, um, I just [00:16:13] started to do a few more dance-y classes that were fitness dance classes. And then I went on to, to train, to teach a dance fitness class myself, and then having done Open Stage Arts, I started to get a bit braver in other things, and I joined a local street dance class and that got me performing again in front of an audience that I didn't know.
So as a teacher of dance fitness, you are performing, but it's to people, you know, and you're telling them what to do. Uh, this being in street dance, which is a completely different style of dance for me. Um, absolutely loved it. It was really difficult to get started, where they have to say. My body was just not dancing in that way. And it still doesn't as well as it should, but it's, it's pretty good. . Um, and performing in front of audiences again, and for performers, you you'll know, they get, I will assume you'll know, Rabiah. I certainly still get very [00:17:13] nervous before any performance.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, absolutely. And surprisingly, so too sometimes, are you ever surprised by how nervous you are?
be fine. And all of a sudden I'm like, uh, what's going on here?
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah, I know exactly what I've got to do. And usually, and I know that I love being on stage and I know that usually when I get in stage, my body takes over and it's all fine, but yeah,
my family, if they come to a performance, they'll laugh at me and say, "Oh, she's going to start going silent now," and start like, you know, pacing around and I can't have my family talking to me, like, uh, get all this that they know what my pre-performance kind of body and emotional state is.
And they just have to leave me alone. But once you step out on the stage and start, absolutely love it, absolutely love it, which is why we keep doing it.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, no, I agree. That's so funny. Cause, um, I I've noticed, I don't [00:18:13] sometimes have respect for myself in the way I should, that I need this quiet time or I need to, I sometimes will just shut my eyes quickly.
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah.
Rabiah (Host): and focus or whatever, but if certain people are there that don't know, then sometimes I just don't even tell them
and I just kind of see what happens to myself, but it's not good. And what happens on stage? It's just kind of like, oh, I'm flustered and
Claire Waite Brown: yeah.
that's where you don't need to be dealing with other people. It's great. When people come to see your performance, but I can't be talking too much beforehand. You were very good. You came and spoke to us beforehand when we came to see you,
but
Rabiah (Host): but then, but that's cause it like day, day four, and I was like, just, okay, I got this kind of thing. Plus I, I did get nervous once I got on stage, like it hit me all of a sudden hit me like a ton of bricks every time. Um, I think one thing that's cool too is just thinking about how it's scary to try new things as an adult.
Cause did you interact with people who had never done theater? I mean, you might've interacted with people that did do [00:19:13] theater and dance, but then people had never done it because I know people like that. So how, I guess if you think about those people, was there a certain way of approaching them or?
Claire Waite Brown: It's all, it all comes down to the initial way. I put the classes across. So, uh, in my website, obviously in all my marketing, I make a very big deal about the fact that it's, pressure-free, it's fun. It's friendly. Um, There is definitely, you see new people coming across the door, who, who want that challenge, but actually are also really scared because you don't, you don't know what to expect.
So, it comes down to the group and I have some wonderful teachers who completely understand the whole ethos of the group and that if people don't want to do something, they don't do it. If something doesn't quite sit right, you know, the teachers can tell and, and react accordingly, but then it's in the group of people as well.
Like people that have been there for a while, [00:20:13] they know what it's like to be there for the first time. And they know how new people feel and, but what tends to happen is there's a lot of laughter in our classes. And what tends to happen is the first muck up, you know, the first thing that you think you've done wrong,
something else I say a lot actually is you can't do anything wrong. There's no wrong. There's just doing something your way or doing something differently, which is fine. Now the first time somebody does maybe think they've done something wrong and it's just, you just laugh about it or you just carry on.
I mean, you'll know about improv, for example, you know, you just gotta keep going with it and just, just go with what you've created. So. I've I've certainly had people say to me at the end of a class that was petrifying, but in a good way. And then you can build on that, but certainly it just comes across with the advertising and the actual atmosphere within a class that it's a really comfortable and safe environment and [00:21:13] doing this stuff really isn't as scary as you might think from the outside.
But I do know people do have a barrier to get through. Sometimes I'll have people book, but they can't quite make it through the door. So there is a definite barrier of taking that first step and challenging yourself. But this is a thing from Open Stage Arts that I've taken to Creativity Found is, to try something.
And don't be afraid if you make a mess of it. I say mess of it. It's not necessarily making a mess of it, but maybe try something and don't do it how you think... it doesn't work out, how you thought it would work out. It's fine. Give it another, go try something different, you know, whatever. Just give it a try.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, I agree with that. And even one place I faced that a lot is like at the gym, I will sign up for class. Like last week I did, I signed up for a class and then I canceled like 24 hours before, because I just was like, oh, I don't want to go in and look like a fool, [00:22:13] but I've also just approached the instructor before and said, Hey, this is my first time.
Just so, you know, um, I might not be comfortable and I feel like when I do that, I feel pretty good. But when I cancel, I feel bad. So I think people, yeah, it's just try, right?
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah.
I do. I do understand that. And I have a, I do have a big fear of the unknown. I think that's what makes me most nervous is not knowing what's going to happen. Um, but as, as a fitness instructor, for example, we are very aware of the people that we're looking at in the class. And we're, most of us are anyway.. Um, there may be some fitness instructors that are more about them than about the class, but most of us are about the class and we, most of us know if you're new anyway, um, depending on the size of the class, but we're there just to make you [00:23:13] feel comforted. And again, with my classes, one of my favorite phrases is, "or something similar" because we do these dance steps and I'll teach them and then I'll say, or something similar.
And if people go off doing something slightly different, that's absolutely fine.
Rabiah (Host): well, yeah, like in yoga, they always had the modified poses.
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah. Yeah.
Rabiah (Host): I basically have done modified yoga for sure. I don't know if I've done regular yoga, but it's all been, you know, modified yoga. So for you, I would say you did something new then with the podcasting and what's going out or, well, we're not really going out with it too much, but, uh, so what was that like for you getting started with a podcast and how did you go about starting your own podcast?
Claire Waite Brown: Well, I'm, I, I'm one of those people that gets an idea and then goes and does it, even though quite often, I don't know how to go and do it. Many moons ago I started a [00:24:13] panto in the village that I live in because the village hall was looking for things to fill it. And some of us in the pub invariably came up with the idea of a panto and nobody else would have done it.
So I did it. I had no idea what I was doing. And six years later, We don't do it now, but we did six or seven years of great fun pantos. And the same with Open Stage Arts, didn't know what I was doing. Same with the podcast. And I just learn as I go along and try not to worry too much. I tend to do this thing where everything's in my head. And then it jiggles around and it jumbles all about, and I'm like, oh, and then I have to organize it, write it down, figure out what I need to do first. And then it sorts itself out. But from a podcast point of view, I had been on a course. Just a, just an hour, like just a workshop on zoom that I thought was going to be about video editing, which I had [00:25:13] recently learned on I movie because I was doing the fit steps classes in lockdown.
I was doing videos for them. So I went on this workshop thing and it ended up being. Actually all about audio editing. And it was particular podcast platform that I'm not very keen on, but I had a lesson in it and I thought, Hey, I could do this. And then I just developed, I found out that that wasn't the right thing for me.
So I tried something else, blah, blah, blah. Learn how to do the audio editing just on garage band board. Did a little bit of research, but a little bit of equipment, not much at all, went out there. As I said, I had a few friends already that I knew their stories would fit, so I went and interviewed them. Put out a message on a Facebook group on an arty-farty Facebook group locally saying, you know,
this is, this is what the point of this podcast [00:26:13] is.
And, I had someone replied to that, went and met her. And then just kind of grew a bit from there. And posting on some groups. And then I started looking around and I'm seeing stuff on social media. I'm like, oh, I like that person's pottery. I'll just go and look at her story and see if she's got a creativity found story.
So I found a couple of people like that , and you probably notice that the not actually the difference in quality from the first episode to how I do it now, obviously we had to go and do things remotely to begin with. I did the remotely on soon, which wasn't ideal, learn how to use some other programs got much better at the editing.
The first time I edited it took for ever. I mean, it takes quite a long time now, but I took such a long time with it the first time and the second time and probably the third time, but it got better each time. So it was just learning as I'm going along. [00:27:13] Meeting people helps you meet other people.
Clubhouse. As you mentioned earlier, we met on Clubhouse, has been amazing for meeting people, especially at the beginning of the year when we were all still stuck indoors. And I think actually, the whole lockdown business has actually opened me up to more Countrywide opportunities and meeting nationwide guests rather than maybe I might have just stuck with Oxford, but I was forced to go online and that opened lots of doors for me.
And so I just, you know, follow along and then ideas come to mind and I follow those.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, I mean, I know with mine, the quality changed. I got it. I got this really horrible microphone that I thought was okay. Now I have a better one and that makes a big difference. And then yeah, editing and I was, I'm a garage band person also, and now I'm using a different thing for transcripts that have done nothing with yet, but I heard we're supposed [00:28:13] to have them.
So,
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah.
Rabiah (Host): you know, but I know exactly what you mean. Just kind of having to tinker with things and learn and keep going at it. And the editing, I haven't found it a way to make it much faster than it is, but I like your editing actually. Cause you, you cut in some music in between things and stuff like that.
And it's, it's cool. So I, I like it.
Claire Waite Brown: Thank you
It does depend on your guests though. And I can tell now on garage band, just by, just by looking, I can tell if there are umms or lots of you knows, or the little, the little ticks that people have that they probably don't realize they have.
Rabiah (Host): You're right. You can tell when you look at the way, the way the waves going, that's funny.
Claire Waite Brown: I always thought that I didn't mind too much because what it, the important thing was the content and it was what was being said. That was important. And I do, I'm an, so my proper job, so to speak, I've been an editor of books for very [00:29:13] many years. So I am. Particularly on that. And I do like editing and organizing, and I do enjoy the audio editing process, uh, because I know that I'm making a really nice, um, product for the listener, without the listener, knowing of everything that's gone on in between time.
Um, and that's what I like about podcasts as well. Is that. You make it as best quality as you can, but you don't have to be studio quality and you don't have to go out to studios and spend lots of money. And, and I'm certainly a fan of the ordinary person doing podcasts. I do personally get a little bit cross about celebrities doing them.
Cause I'm like, you've got your platform. You're already on the tele or the radio. Leave the podcasts to us.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah, I agree. And it is funny cause I don't, I guess we'll know. And I don't cut every, [00:30:13] especially the things I say. I leave a lot of my blunders in for sure, but I don't cut every. Single filler word out. Cause there's no point that's not how people talk. And I think if you listen to someone who I'm saying, if I'm telling my listeners, oh, I hope you're relate to this person.
And then they're so incredibly well-spoken that they never have a problem. It doesn't even make any sense. That's so unrelatable,
Claire Waite Brown: yes. Yeah, yeah,
Rabiah (Host): So I'm with you and then yeah, on the subject too, of just the ordinary person being a podcaster versus. Well, the thing with the celebrity podcasts and I listen to some of them and some of them, I don't of course, but you end up with the same guests on every single one.
So what's cool about our podcast is you don't do that, you know? And so, yeah, like neither one of us is going to end up, you know, on Chelsea handler's podcast at this point or whatever, which is fine, you know, unless she wants us on, I mean, have us on, but.
So for [00:31:13] you other than, or maybe we've already talked about it, but just, what do you find the most rewarding about the medium of podcasting for you? What's been the most rewarding thing.
Claire Waite Brown: Um, And this, this probably could have happened another way with something else, but it has been the meeting people and the ability to meet people and to hear their stories. And all of my guests obviously have, have a challenge that they've had to overcome in order to get to back to their creativity and, um, It's always a positive story because obviously I'm speaking to them because they have got to that bit of creativity.
Um, but it's also understanding the very similar themes that keep coming up. Uh, whether that be about education or I thought I was rubbish or somebody told me I should do it, made me not want to do it. And I, I now come across a few similar [00:32:13] themes as we're going along. So I just find it really interesting. It's all down to the meeting, the people and, and the guests, and also learning about their art forms as well. Cause I love to see. I don't consider myself. This is something I was talking about on another podcast, because I'm like, I don't consider myself to be "a creative" because what is "a creative"?
Is it someone that creates something? Is it someone that paints a picture or puts on a show in some ways it is in other ways, it's a way that you find to do something, whether that be overcome a problem or just make some food or, or just get everything out of yourself. So, but I do like to learn about how other people are doing it and even how it has come to them, because for some people it's come from somewhere completely unexpected. Like they've [00:33:13] got some acrylic paint and it's just, they've always painted. This was Farrah for example. She had, when she was younger painted representational. And then when she was in India, she bought some metallic acrylic paints and out came these abstracts and she had no idea where that came from.
So it's those artistic outpourings that also, you know, , really interest me and I get to look at some wonderful art.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. Yeah, it's true. No, it's great. And I think I agree. I mean, I'm, I'm always, actually one of my favorite parts about it is even the editing too, because I always, I don't like though I'm present during these conversations. I don't know about you. I'm not always able to absorb everything, someone saying as soon as I'd be like, oh, I didn't realize how impactful that was or something,
right?
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah.
I find that. And I find that in other situations as well, because for example at Open Stage Arts, I, I [00:34:13] am often looking and making sure that the people in the class are happy. So sometimes I'm not fully engaged with the activity that we're doing. If I feel like someone, people are people a little different, this is the weird thing.
And if I feel like someone, isn't, isn't going well with what we're doing, that that can affect me. And I'm not fully engaged. And the same with doing a recording. I can sometimes be thinking, right, I wanted the person to speak a bit about this, or we've gone off somewhere and I want to steer it back. And I agree with you.
I've then gone back and listened and gone. Oh, oh, I hadn't quite cottoned on to that at the time. So, Yeah,
I do. I know what you mean, but crafting. So it is creating because you're crafting then this end product that somebody is going to enjoy listening to. So that is extremely satisfying.
Rabiah (Host): actually, that is so funny cause that's where I wanted you to get, not with that sentence, but I was thinking about telling you even [00:35:13] after I was actually thinking, oh, after I'm going to mention, yeah, you are a creator, but anyway, you got there. Ah,
mind, these mind tricks are working where I'll teach you.
Claire Waite Brown: I find my own revelation.
Rabiah (Host): That's what we're about. We'll have an epiphany series. So for you, so you mentioned that your professional career has been in editing, but then you've maintained, like with Open Stage Arts and now Creativity Found where you're really promoting other's creativity and now we realized creating your own thing.
So what impact has once you founded Open Stage Arts, and then now doing this, what impact has that had on your life would you say and maybe even your overall happiness, your family or anything because you have your day job still, but you're doing this?
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah, I think it's given me, um, When I say confidence, I don't mean confidence. [00:36:13] I mean, it's given me something of my own and that is actually where Open Stage Arts came from as well cause I realized I didn't have something of my own, but that was for enjoyment. I didn't have something that I was doing just for me, for enjoyment.
And then I didn't find it so I ended up starting Open Stage Arts, which is now a business. So it's not quite just for me, for my enjoyment, but these projects, so to speak, are my own. And once again, look with got another epiphany. They are my own creations. So by confidence, I mean, I have something that is all mine, that I've created, that I'm sustaining. Um, with work and children in a way you are doing it for an another end. And I loved my editing. My editing. I ended up doing, I wanted to do Like, um, [00:37:13] high FIC literature fiction. And I ended up falling into illustrated nonfiction, which I absolutely love. And in fact, I do know a lot now about what some of my guests do because I've edited a lot of craft and art books. And there's a creativity in those books that I wouldn't have got.
If I'd been doing the fiction, I don't think I would have enjoyed it. I think I would have found it very boring. So, so I've loved that, but it was for someone else. It w it was always a job, so to speak as much as I loved that it's going in that direction. This is what you do to earn money. You make a book, somebody else buys the book.
And then when you have the children, you do what needs to be done to feed, clothe, take to school, take to swimming, la-di-da, everything, your whole, your whole life schedule is built around the money work and children, and with [00:38:13] Open Stage Arts and Creativity Found, it's given me like things to do each day. Where I used to have a very strict framework of the children go to school so I'll work, then I'll take them swimming or do whatever we have to do. That is less so now; children are much older, have a lot of their own things to do. Don't need me doing that.
I do take them to museums and they get cross with me, but you have to do those errands, but I have another framework now that is, that is all about me. And. Other people. Well, it is about other people, but it gives me a satisfaction that I've created it. I've invented it so to speak and now I'm making it happen.
Rabiah (Host): I think one thing people do is they judge themselves all the time. And so they might think just, I'm thinking about a few friends in particular, but, and even myself sometimes, but yeah, you are kind of setting your own path and, you're not like beholden to other people necessarily, or if you are it's your choice. I mean, I think I'm not a parent, [00:39:13] but I think parents as, as wonderful as being a parent is I think it also has to be really hard because you guys don't get a day off. I mean, you just don't. You know, and if you do, it means you've arranged for someone to do something and then you're owing them.
And I don't know, it seems like a lot. I mean, I have plants and that, you know, I'm even worried about when I leave to go visit home, what am I going to do with these plants? I don't know what I do with kids.
Claire Waite Brown: Just leave them with a drip feed of water.
Rabiah (Host): That's true. Oh yeah. I was going to look into, yeah, see you reminded me. So I'm curious too about dance. I think it's so cool. I almost was thinking, oh, I should try that. And I, then I pictured myself falling, but what dance were you trained in? What type of dance?
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah, uh, contemporary dance which wasn't my thing either. So I wanted to be all hands, jazz hands, and I wanted to do shows like musical theater type stuff. And I would have been happy in a chorus. I had no, you know, I [00:40:13] didn't want to be. A main player. I just wanted to dance and I did dance in . Um, while I was doing my GCCS and my a levels, I was still doing that and I just started enjoyed that performance.
But, um, so I would have liked to have gone to one of those jazz hands type theater, theater, arts dance schools. But, um, my mum was having none of that. It's Okay,
she won't listen to this. I won't tell her. So the compromise was that I had to do a degree, so I did a degree in dance. And at that time there were only, I think there were only about three unis that were doing dance degrees and they will all contemporary. And, um, I had a great time at my university and I did enjoy the dance. It was a lot of choreography and you were all meant to be new and finding new ways of moving and new ways of expression. And I was like, I just want to do the old ways of dancing. [00:41:13] So I did thoroughly enjoy that, but it wasn't where I wanted to go.
And I think that is what then made me change course. And I can actually remember being in this part of uni where you used to have to go to get your mail from the pigeonholes. For some reason I was sitting down and said, "I know I'm not good enough at dance to make a career of it. So I'll choose my next favorite thing, which is books."
Um, so I made, a career in publishing by just sending my CVs out and just getting whatever job was offered me. Um, and I did a bit of contemporary dance in London, the place on the side, and then that just kind of fizzled out and it wasn't a conscious decision. It just kind of fizzled out cause I was working and we were going out and enjoying ourselves and own blah-di-blah.
So when I started again, [00:42:13] I was doing aerobics classes, we've moved on from aerobics then, it was like body conditioning and things. So it wasn't that long ago, about seven, eight years ago. And I was doing some of these classes. I was thinking, oh, I could train in this and I could teach these kinds of classes.
So I went and did my exercise to music qualification, which was fabulous. I think I was in my early forties at that stage. So. And myself and one other lady, we were off that age. Everybody else was a lot younger doing that course, but I had an most wonderful time. So we've got that qualification. And then very soon after this opportunity came up to train in a particular dance fitness program called fit steps, which is based on the Latin American and ballroom dance.
It's all strictly come dancing time. So this is strictly come. Dancing is super popular and this thing came up. So I'd never done that kind of dance before either. Um, but it's [00:43:13] really suits me and it's really enjoyable. Um, and that helped me, I think, to try some other dance classes and stuff, and eventually do the, um, do the street dance that I do now as well.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. Oh, that's so cool. Awesome. Thanks for telling me about that cause I really like, I don't know the street dancing. I kind of want to see that now.
It sounds, sounds really cool. So do you have, we've shared a lot, we've had some epiphanies, but do you have any advice or mantra that you want to share that you'd like to just maybe you refer to or that you like to share with others?
Claire Waite Brown: Well only what we've already touched on actually is to try it even if you're scared that you might make a mess of it, it's not, you know, it's not brain surgery. You're not going to kill anyone. If you want to go do a watercolor course, or you want to try pottery, what's the worst that can happen? It might look a mess. It might look like a monster, but you're not going to have killed anybody.
Rabiah (Host): that's, that's true. And that's a good. That's a good litmus [00:44:13] test for if you should try something or not. Will, will you kill anyone? No, then try it.
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah.
Rabiah (Host): I like it. No, that's giving yourself permission though, right?
Rabiah (Host): Awesome. so I have a set of questions called the "Fun Five" that I ask every guest. So we'll get into those.
So the first one, what's the oldest t-shirt you have and still wear.
Claire Waite Brown: Okay. So I'm going to be a difficult guest at, I get a slightly change that, um, too, I want to tell you about a denim jacket. I have this denim jacket. It's probably about 2019 years old. Cause I remember buying it when Sydney was a baby and I bought it from French connection. Um, I see the only thing I could possibly ever wear from French connection, but for some reason I was able to wear that and it's, and I still wear it now, but the reason I wanted to tell you about it, excuse me.
If I [00:45:13] laugh, nobody else laughs at this story, but I have a story. So a couple of years ago we were at Disney World. And they have these, um, we call them badges. They call them pins, obviously the Americans, with their different words. So they have these lovely metal pins of all the Disney characters and my daughter and I were at one of these concessions looking at these pins and I was saying, well, they're lovely, but I don't know what I do with them. And this lady next to me, she's turned around and she said, She said, "have you got a ginger cat?" In the split moment when someone took soon, you've got to answer. I was like, well, actually I do have a ginger cat honestly, I do. So I said, And she said, put the pins on she [00:46:13] was saying, again, an Americanism, "jean jacket". it took me a while, did buy two of these pins. I have Tigger and Winnie the Pooh and of the 101 Dalmatians and they are on this standing jacket that I still wear to this day. But when we now call this dating jacket, my ginger cat.
Rabiah (Host): That's great because it's so ridiculous, but I know, I know. And we do use different words there for sure. So I've got a Jean jacket, but I'm just thinking like this pin cushion cat you have now, too, but like the thing is, so I wear jeans most of the time, that's my choice, but, or my choice of attire, it's not like, it's my choice,
someone's forcing some other kind of trousers on me. But the thing is that throws me off here is the word pants. Right. Because I would just say, [00:47:13] I've got to change my pants and then that'll sound like I'm gonna change my underwear. It's like, what's up with her? That's weird. Yeah. So I know we use different words in the States.
So now I'm always like careful, like my denim trousers, I call them sometimes, which I know is super awkward to.
Claire Waite Brown: That's just weird.
Rabiah (Host): It is weird. Cause I didn't want to say jeans cause I didn't know. Cause people say denim and I don't know what to call them, so. All right. Well that was a good, I mean, people laugh. I'm sure. Let us know if you laugh.
Claire Waite Brown: I still laugh.
about it every time.
Rabiah (Host): Well, if you laughed, let us know. You'll be following Creativity Found and me, so let us know. Um, all right. If every day was really Groundhog's Day, I mean, now it's not as much so as it was, but still a little bit. Uh, what song would you have your alarm clock set to play every morning?
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah. I like this. So I'm going with The WKND, Blinding [00:48:13] Lights, because it doesn't get old. I, I think it's the best song ever. And, um, I never tire of hearing. So I wouldn't say like, that's my favorite song. Cause I have favorite songs from my past and, you know, remind me of something, but that I think I could listen to that song every single day and not get tired of it.
And it just makes me so happy.
Rabiah (Host): Yeah. And I mean, I'm already thinking of it. Like it's just, it's good. Yeah. Okay. That's cool. All right, so coffee or tea or neither?
Claire Waite Brown: Well, Rabiah, I think, you know the answer
to
Rabiah (Host): know. And I'm having tea some with you spilling it, but
Claire Waite Brown: it is definitely tea and um, your other part in the show was, I was compelled to speak out because she was complaining about tea she's another American and she was [00:49:13] complaining in the show about tea. And I was like, I'm not having that. Don't you go complaining about tea?
Yes, I am tea through and through. I, I drink so many cups of tea a day. I don't have milk. I now tend to have green tea. I did have decaf black tea. Um, yeah.
I started having decaf. I had anxiety and it started giving me heebie-jeebies. So I've been decaf ever since, but yeah, T all the way, and I won't hear a bad word said about it.
Rabiah (Host): I like tea. I like tea. Just to be clear. Cool. And, okay, so this, we might've gotten into this already, but can you think of a time you like laughed so hard, you cried or just couldn't stop. Whether it's the last time you did that or any time.
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah recently, actually we were on holiday in Kent and the four of us were at dinner and we started playing. It was Charlie's idea because this is something else I've bought from Open Stage Arts, is making us play drama [00:50:13] games at the table. So we started playing. Who am I? You know, where you have to do yes, no answers.
And, um, we ended up just in hilarity and I can not remember exactly which comments made us laugh so much, but the waitress in the restaurant was quite amused by the whole table laughing out loud. Um, and there was another instance, but this is really me now. I don't know why I found it so funny, but it was watching that show on TV, which was, "You've Been Framed". I always want to call it Whose Line Is It, Anyway? Obviously it isn't. And there wasthis little girl, she was sit - she didn't hurt herself. She was sitting down for some reason, she's just kind of slid and it was her face. And for some reason, Charlie and I just got in a right giggle loop of that and we just could not get out of that. So nice. A little bit mean, yeah.
Rabiah (Host): No, there was a guest that said little kids falling is what? Yeah.
Claire Waite Brown: [00:51:13] Not generally, for me,
Rabiah (Host): But in
Claire Waite Brown: but
Rabiah (Host): that case, yeah. No, it's okay. I mean, it's not meant to be a nice question. It's just a, it's just a question, you know. And the last one who inspires you right now?
Claire Waite Brown: Okay, well, this is probably going to sound a bit sycophantic and cheesy, but all of my guests, I mean, they are the ones that have inspired me to keep going with the podcast. Their stories inspire me. Every new guests that I meet, the challenges that they faced and, and got over is inspirational for me and obviously I hope it's going to be inspirational and encouraging for everybody that listens as well.
Rabiah (Host): Cool. I agree. I, that happens with me too. And then, is there anything you want to promote or any where you want people to go to find you I'll link to your Instagram, for example, but do you just want to tell people where, where to look for you?
Claire Waite Brown: Yeah. Do have a look at basically it's creativity [00:52:13] found dot co dot uk. I'm building it up right now. I'm really well, see that's something else I've had to learn is, is building the website and how to systematically make that work well, which is another kind of editorial thing to make it really easy for people to use.
But anyway, that aside. Do you have a look at that cause I'm gradually building up and adding more people to it. So have a look, you can find the podcast episodes that you can find some art, some of my guests there, some of the artists, some of their exhibitions and some of the workshops that are on offer.
So I would say all you need to know is creativity found.
Rabiah (Host): Awesome. Cool. Well, Claire, this has been a lot of fun. Thank you so much for being, yeah.
Claire Waite Brown: Thank you.
Rabiah (Host): Thank you so much for being a guest.
Claire Waite Brown: Oh, you're welcome. Thank you.
Rabiah (Host): Thanks again for listening this week, you can find out more about the guest in the show notes. and at rabiahsaid.com. Joe Maffia created the music just for [00:53:13] this podcast. Find him on Spotify. That's Joe M a F F I a. And Rob Metke is responsible for our visual design. You can find him online by searching for Rob M E T K E. Thanks, Rob. Let me know who you'd like to hear from or about your own experiences to finding yourself outside of work. Follow at morethanworkpod, or send a message on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, or LinkedIn, or visit our website morethanworkpod.com. Give us a follow on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you get your podcasts and leave a review if you like. Thanks for listening to more than work while being kind to others. Don't forget to be kind to yourself.
